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heloflor · 2 years ago

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Cartters and why it grew on me as the show went on

Aka “A recap/analysis of the evolution of Cartman and Butters’ friendship, mostly seen from Cartman’s angle, and why it eventually led me to ship Cartters despite their incredibly rocky beginning,” but that’s too long of a title.

THIS POST WAS WRITTEN BEFORE “STREAMING WARS” CAME OUT. AS OF YET, I HAVEN’T WATCHED THOSE SPECIALS SO NO MENTION OF THEIR EVENTS WILL OCCUR. Let’s see how well this post aged in the span of one special, shall we ?

Tl;Dr : Like every Cartman relationship, his friendship with Butters is a very interesting relationship to explore, especially on Cartman’s side given how much he grew to appreciate the blond and let him get close to him, on top of slowly learning how to be a “decent” friend to him, leading to them becoming best friends starting with S17.

Though, the relationship still has tons of baggage from all the trauma Cartman subjected Butters to. And while Cartman has been shown to become a better friend towards Butters, it does leave the question of how much is Cartman capable of changing for a friend and, as a result, how healthy can their friendship become.

First things first, as said in this post, I’ve known South Park for years, watched the full show almost two years ago and recently got back into the fandom as a lurker, looking up meta.

So, when I got back into South Park two years ago, I found myself starting to ship St//yle and Cartters (and for some reason I really like those relationships as one-sided, or as I like to call it “Stan and Cartman pining after straight guys” but that’s not the topic here).

While the former didn’t surprise me since I love the “best friends to lovers” trope, the latter really did. I mean, I don’t like Ky//man due to how abusive it is, and yet here am I shipping Cartman with the kid he had tortured the most throughout the show.

Although, I actually don’t want Cartters to be canon, or at least not now. I’d much rather see them focus on growing a healthy friendship, or at least as healthy as someone like Cartman is capable of, before even considering the idea of a romance.

Fun fact about that actually : when I got into SP back then, I didn’t look up Cartters stuff because I felt weird about shipping it. But back in February, when the interest for the show came back, I jumped right into that ship.

And after seeing many posts about this relationship + thinking about it a bit, I realized that they do have a meaningful relationship (that has no right being this wholesome for someone like Cartman but I digress). That’s what we’re going to talk about here.

Btw, I hope I’m not stepping on anyone’s toes with this post since I don’t intend to actively participate in the fandom…

This post will be cut in three main parts :

Firstly, the evolution of their relationship throughout the show, specifically how Cartman grew fond of Butters, with a few precisions on some episodes. This part is the longest and literally makes for about half the post

Secondly, a few words about what I interpret their sexualities to be, in particular talking about Cartman and his obsessive behavior.

Finally, what the two currently think of each other with a few ideas on how their friendship can develop + one last part about my opinion on other Cartman and Butters ships in case people are curious.

Oh yeah and because I don’t want to make too many SP posts, some stuff won’t be that related to the topic but it’s still stuff I wanted to infodump about. So expect this post to be a bit off-topic at times.

Btw, a lot of stuff here was already said by other blogs before, but I still wanted to “compile” all I learned about these two and their relationship, on top of adding my own views on it.

Have a Google Doc version since it’s probably much easier to read

VERY, VERY LONG POST AHEAD ! I’m talking close to 20k words !

(Oh and for those asking, the dots in-between paragraphs are due to my blog theme doing weird shit with spaces. Since this post would be way too bothersome to read without spaces, I’m not taking chances.)

1. The evolution of their friendship

Alright so, despite being a show that prides itself on comedy and satire first and foremost, South Park has quite some character development there and there (Stan and Kyle’s friendship, the 4th grade going from the whole class being bullies to only two of them, stuff like that). And one of the things that evolved is the relationship between Cartman and Butters, which was also impacted by Butters’ own character development.

Speaking of which, a quick side-note about Butters’ character development to make it shorter afterwards (yes we’re starting off with something off-topic, that’s how much this post derails 😓) :

- In seasons 1-3, Butters was a non character. He was just prop that could be used there and there. Sometimes he was a bully, sometimes a victim. His name wasn’t even Butters back then.

- Season 4 and especially season 5 is when Butters’ personality started to take form, with him being at the bottom of the social ladder, being viewed as the lamest kid in class and being bullied by everyone else.

- Seasons 6-11 are basically the “Butters torture” seasons, with Butters being the punching bag of the show and always getting in trouble or suffering due to others. We could see him try to stand his ground there and there, but he always immediately fell back to being compliant. A good example of that is the phone call in “Majo//rine”.

- Seasons 12-15 is when Butters starts standing up to himself, with the best examples being “Butters Bottom Bitch” and “Super Fun Time”. He’s still a victim that gets taken advantage of by the others, but he’s slowly growing. He’s also starting to be more of a douche/bully like in “The List”.

- Season 16, more specifically “Butterballs” and “Going Native” is when Butters became the kid we now know him to be. A gentle and sweet kid who’s also an unhinged piece of shit that can go apeshit at any point. He’s also the only bully the grade has left along with Cartman, and grew to be quite the corrupted businessman. Like, compare him trying to do telemarketing in “Kenny Dies” (S5) to his ability to copy Cartman’s tone perfectly in “Go Fund Yourself” (S18).

Now, onto the relationship between the two :

So, when the show started, their relationship was absolutely horrendous, there’s no denying that. Cartman was constantly messing with Butters for shit and giggles and got the kid tortured and almost killed quite a handful of times. Seriously, if I were to make a “top 10 worst things Cartman has ever done”, most spots would absolutely be stuff related to Butters (not the first 3-4 spots tho. Stuff like using Cthulhu, the Tenorman incident or the therapist’s wife murder are in my eyes much worse, especially the Cthulhu stuff).

At that time though, there are already three notable things about Cartman :

1. The way he’s constantly thinking about messing with Butters specifically, plus the way he always seeks his help despite having kids like Clyde who’s just as easy to manipulate, does show that Cartman already had an unhealthy obsession with the kid. Yeah, Kyle isn’t the only one Cartman’s obsessed with.

2. While I don’t consider “Awesome-O” to be a Cartters episode per say (Cartman was only being nice out of desperation for the tape, Butters had no idea it was Cartman and expressed anger towards the kid at the beginning), it is worth noting that Cartman never tries to get back at Butters for showing the tape to everyone.

And yes, the show doesn’t have that big of a continuity, but Cartman doesn’t even threaten Butters about it at the end of the episode. He just accepts defeat, as if capable of feeling some sort of “respect” when someone is doing something vengeful and clever, at least enough respect not to get revenge for it.

3. In “Douche and Turd”, there’s that moment when the kids are in the gymnasium and Cartman insults Kyle, with Butters quickly parroting Cartman’s words before the two share a glance. In that scene, Cartman raises an eyebrow while smiling, as if thinking “I can use this”.

Makes me wonder if this is the moment Cartman realized Butters would always help him with his schemes, hence why he started latching onto that kid instead of asking any other gullible kid.

Then, a few seasons later, we get to “The Death of Eric Cartman”, the episode with the ending that made me go “sigh…I’m going to start shipping these two, aren’t I…?” (although, despite seeing potential, I was barely into the ship at that point)

In this episode, Cartman thinks he’s dead because everyone is ignoring him, but Butters didn’t get the memo. As a result, the two spend the whole day together with Butters helping Cartman “move on”.

By the end of it, there’s that speech Cartman gives Butters about how the two of them became friends. And while Cartman immediately takes it back upon realizing he’s alive, it doesn’t change the fact that he seemed sincere when he gave that speech.

As a result, it really feels like this episode was the key moment when Cartman realized Butters isn’t that bad and can be kind of fun to be around. It feels like it’s past that point that Cartman starts softening up, at least a little bit.

Following on this, you have “Smug Alert”, in which Cartman ends up trusting Butters with his life…sorta. Cartman goes into San Francisco with Butters being his only contact and way out, trusting Butters to pull him back once he reaches Kyle.

Btw, about that, can we take a second to appreciate Butters in this episode ? No because we always talk about Cartman saving Kyle, but not only did Butters help as well, he was just as much in danger as the two when the storm hit ! And Butters didn’t even particularly like or care for either of them at that point. He could’ve easily left them both to die, but he didn’t !

But yeah, long story short, between Cartman trusting Butters with something so important + him asking Butters to keep secret at the end, it seems that this episode really cemented Butters as Cartman’s sidekick/second-in-command, with Cartman not only going to him for any task moving forward but also letting him know the important details of his schemes, growing his trust for the kid.

Then you have “Tonsil Trouble”. It’s not that big of a moment but it is worth mentioning how Cartman doesn’t immediately kill Butters right after the boy kisses him on the cheek in public. And on top of that, later on, Cartman asks Butters’ help to get inside Kyle’s room despite Cartman himself admitting he’s done it many times, meaning he doesn’t actually need help.

Tbh, I could definitely see Cartman feeling lonely at times during his schemes, and since Butters is quick to agree to help, he’s probably using it as an excuse to have some company. “Jewpacabra” is another good example that further fuels this headcanon.

Oh and after that, when Kyle says that Butters told him about sneaking into his room, Cartman gets mildly annoyed about it and doesn’t try to get back at Butters for it.

Again, not really big moments but it does seem like Cartman is at the very least seeing Butters as useful enough to tolerate and keep around, even if he gets annoyed with the kid.

After that, you have “Super Fun Time”, another episode that’s pretty big when it comes to their relationship. This episode is the first time Butters really stands up for himself against Cartman, tho it’s a bit sad he’s only doing it in fear of punishment.

In this episode, there’s one moment I especially like : when they arrive at the “Phun Time” place, Cartman tries yet again to pry Butters off in fear of people calling them gay. After some struggle, Cartman lets out a “Jesus Christ” while having an expression showing that he’s actually understanding that he’s not getting out of there. And after that, he stops arguing about the hand and even tries to include Butters in his activities.

Basically, Butters sets a boundary in this episode and sticks to it, forcing Cartman to work around it instead of blasting his way through it like he usually does. That’s why I like this scene so much, it’s the moment we see Cartman realizing he has to compromise this time around if he wants to have his fun. In other words, Butters holds a bit of power over Cartman, as little as it might be, and it’s great to see it.

There’s also the moment when they get back and see the police. Butters starts crying about how much trouble they’re about to be in while Cartman tries to calm him down so that they can sneak back in. What’s interesting here is that Cartman seems to feel genuine guilt about making Butters cry. Or at the very least he seems to be aware that he’s responsible for Butters’ tears and isn’t happy about it.

In any case, we see Cartman being capable of feeling some sort of regret after hurting another person.

For those asking : what makes me say Cartman shows regret is the sad expression he has after Butters “punches” him + after Butters explains why he’s not letting go of his hand.

Hell, while you could say that the first face is out of surprise from Butters punching him, Cartman was arguing about the hand in the second moment but immediately stops and caves to Butters’ demands, really making it seem like he feels guilty.

(Btw, it’s off-topic but Butters is the absolute MVP of this episode. Him throwing Cartman at the armed guy in frustration was especially delightful to see ! Stan showing off his dorky side was great too !)

Last thing about this episode : I’ve seen people make jokes about how Cartman spends the entire episode bitching about holding Butters’ hand, but then the very next episode is “The China Problem” which has Cartman holding Butters’ hand while the kid is taking a bath. And joke aside, I do find it interesting that Cartman went so quickly to Butters and even trusted him with a gun.

Basically, despite SP not being about character arcs, if you view it from a “character development” point of view anyways, the fact that those two episodes are back-to-back really makes it seem like Butters’ badass actions in “Super Fun Time” left an impact on Cartman, hence why he would trust the kid with a deadly weapon or why he’s so disappointed about him shooting guys in the dick.

Following this, in seasons 12-14, you have a few moments that aren’t particularly big but show Cartman being more chill. For example, you have his reaction to the “hickey” in “The Ungroundable”, which was pretty tame coming from Cartman. There’s also him being the one holding the gift in “Eat, Pray, Queef” when the 4th grade boys visit Butters, or Cartman being more sad than angry in “The Tale of Scrotie Mcboogerballs” when Butters tells the main 4 off.

Along with that, you have Butters growing more confident but also becoming more of a bully, which likely brought the duo closer by making Butters not be at the bottom of the social ladder anymore, all the while getting on Cartman’s good side (obviously him always being present in Cartman’s schemes helps as well).

Then you have another important episode : “Poor and Stupid”.

Thing is, while Cartman can be very pathetic at times in front of the other kids, he’s also a very prideful person. But in this episode, there’s that scene where Cartman ends up in the hospital due to his own stupidity. And while he’s here, Butters is by his side, still encouraging him and comforting him, not once showing any negative judgment for what happened.

As a result, it feels like this episode is when Cartman realized that he can open up emotionally to Butters, which is seen later on in “Cartman finds Love”.

On top of that, there’s the fact that Cartman got rid of his plushies in “1%”, and said episode cemented that the plushies were Cartman’s emotional support. So once they’re gone, he needs another way to get support.

And yes, I know in “The Return of Chef” we see Butters at Cartman’s house to comfort him, but he barely approached the guy + Cartman didn’t confide much in him that time around.

And finally, starting with seasons 16-17, especially 17, Cartman and Butters became best friends, with Cartman especially showing a lot more appreciation for the kid than you’d expect from him.

Btw I say especially S17 because, while Cartman is nicer in S16 as well, this season also ends with “Obama Wins”, in which Cartman tries to kill Butters for betraying him so that’s a big yikes. The fact that it was the last time he tried killing him doesn’t make it any less ok.

Now, since their relationship hasn’t evolved that much since S17, let me give a compilation of moments from post-S16 episodes in which we see Cartman being a softie for this kid :

- Informative Murder Porn : The kids learn about their parents playing Minecraft through Butters explaining how his dad killed his mom. As he’s talking, he’s crying on the ground, with both Kenny and Cartman by his side putting a comforting hand on his shoulders. So we get to see Cartman trying to comfort Butters, aka trying to be there emotionally for him.

What’s also interesting here is the facial expressions. While Kenny is looking at Butters with a saddened expression, Cartman has an eyebrow raised. My interpretation of this, especially compared to the crying scene in “Super Fun Time”, is that the reason why Cartman is raising an eyebrow is because he doesn’t feel bad for Butters.

After all, Cartman is either a narcissist or a sociopath. Either way, it means he has incredibly limited empathy/sympathy/compassion. In “Informative Murder Porn”, Butters is crying due to something his parents did, aka something that has nothing to do with Cartman. So Cartman is physically incapable of feeling bad for Butters. Hence the mention of “Super Fun Time” since Cartman was responsible in this case and felt guilty.

But despite not feeling bad, Cartman still cares about Butters, so he puts a comforting hand on his shoulder nonetheless because he wants the kid to feel better.

Another thing about this episode I’ve seen people point out is the fact that Cartman only takes the lead after seeing Stephen losing it, making it seem like he’s doing it for Butters (and possibly Stan since we see Randy messing around as well). But tbh it feels like a bit of a stretch ?

Idk, Cartman’s a bit weird being so helpful in such a situation in which he has nothing to gain from (the kids are worried about their parents killing each other. Cartman only has one parent, and as protective as he can be, I don’t think he views the men his mom sleeps with as any more threatening than usual in this scenario). Maybe he just likes the feeling of being in charge, especially since in this case he’s taking the leadership away from Kyle ?

- The Magic Bush : While from an “episode” standpoint, I’m neutral on this one, I absolutely adore it from a “Cartters” standpoint. The entire episode is just Butters getting angry at Cartman, shoving him against a bathroom stall twice and in general yelling at him, and not only does Cartman let him get away with it, he also keeps helping Butters up until the end !

Hell, throughout the entire episode, Cartman tries to get himself out of trouble. But at the very end, Butters is still unsatisfied. And Cartman, who just spent days trying to wash his hands off, is willing to put himself right back into trouble just to make Butters happy.

And, again, Butters spent the whole episode yelling at Cartman and getting violent ! So this ending shows how Cartman’s “this is the last time I’m helping you” lines were all empty threats.

All-in-all, this episode is just Butters being the one taking the reins of this relationship for once and it is incredibly satisfying to see him able to get away with being so angry at Cartman !

Another thing I find very interesting about this episode is the fact that, on a regular “Cartman and Butters” episode, Cartman gives orders and Butters follows without much questioning. But this time, Butters actually gets angry at Cartman’s scheme and starts doubting him.

That’s another fact about this episode I love : Cartman doesn’t just keep his scheme going to protect himself, he also has to prove that he’s trustworthy.

Sure, Cartman does his thing and when Butters questions it, he explains himself and tells Butters to trust him. But the important part is that Cartman does make things better for Butters. He tells Butters to trust him and then has to deliver on that trust. I really, really like that this episode took that direction.

In a way, I feel like this episode could be a step leading Butters to trust Cartman a little more when things go wrong in their schemes.

Btw, it’s worth noting that at any point Cartman could’ve thrown Butters under the bus like he did so many times before. But he didn’t. And I think that’s also why him proving himself trustworthy works so well here. Instead of trying to screw over Butters, he’s trying to keep the kid by his side and help him, even if it means getting his hands dirty again right after getting away with his dumb idea.

Oh and something very important I almost forgot : around the beginning of the “third act”, when Butters shows up at Cartman’s house to make demands, he points out how miserable the whole thing is making him (probably as a way to scold Cartman since, again, Butters’ here to make demands).

And when he does, Cartman asks Butters what’s wrong and listens when Butters starts ranting, quickly caving in to his demands. Cartman actually tries to be there for Butters on an emotional level, despite Cartman himself being terrible when it comes to emotions on a non-manipulative level.

- Grounded Vindaloop : While there aren’t that many interactions between them as it’s more of a “main 4” episode, we do have quite a handful of moments in which Cartman shows actual concern.

First of all, there’s the prank itself. Cartman in the past has been absolutely horrendous towards Butters and used to have a kick out of torturing the kid in the worst ways. As a result, the prank he pulls in this episode is very tame in comparison (hell even Stan points it out).

All Cartman does is make Butters believe he’s in virtual reality to have a laugh and make him do a few chores. And yet, Cartman refers to this prank as “the height of Butters torture”. To say Cartman toned it down with his pranks would be an understatement.

Then, you have the scene when Butters goes apeshit.

Side note : A funny thing I noticed about Butters being unhinged is how the main 4 realize it one after the other. Stan finds out in “Butterballs”, Kenny in “Going Native”, Kyle in S20 and, in this episode, we learn in the cafeteria scene that Cartman has known for a while now given how he says the prank is a way to put Butters back in his place.

So when Butters punches his dad, Cartman doesn’t find it hilarious or laughingly thinks about how much trouble Butters will be in. Instead, he understands that Butters is about to go apeshit and immediately tries to calm him down and bring him back to his place.

Also, while Cartman is obviously worried about getting himself in trouble, there is some concern for Butters as well :

When Butters says he hit a lamppost, Cartman tenses up in fear, only calming down when Butters says he’s back up. Same when Butters screams, which also has Cartman calling Butters’ name twice with the second time being in a very small voice.

Then, the next scene is in the hospital. But since Butters was in “the bad part of town” and only Cartman knew about it, it gives off the impression that Cartman was the one to call an ambulance.

On top of that, when Cartman shows up to scare Butters into silence, literally the first thing that comes out of his mouth when he appears is “are you okay ?”, showing concern for Butters’ well-being.

Then, a few minutes later in the episode, you have Cartman being pissed off at Butters by thinking he’s an AI messing with him. And yet Cartman still talks about helping Butters out.

But more importantly, there’s that scene near the end of the episode. Stan, Kyle and Cartman are in Butters’ room with Stephen being furious about their presence. Stephen then proceeds to take his belt off, implying he’s going to hit his son with it.

When this happens, the other three look for a sec before Stan goes back to his phone call and Kyle follows suit immediately. But Cartman doesn’t. For a few more seconds, Cartman looks at the Stotches with worry before finally getting back to the phone call.

Compare that last scene to that one episode in S6 in which Cartman prank calls the Stotches parents to get Butters beaten up for shit and giggles.

In the span of 12 seasons, Cartman went from making Butters suffer for fun to showing genuine worry seeing the very same action he once happily caused.

That, right here, is growth. Cartman at some point stopped seeing Butters’ suffering as funny and even starts showing concern at the thought of Butters living in an abusive home.

- You’re Not Yelping : There are only two moments in this one but the first is pretty big.

Basically, we see Cartman abuse his power as a yelp reviewer to get free food. And early in the episode, we see him give food to Butters.

But the thing is, in their dialogue, there’s no indication that Cartman is asking for any money or service in exchange. Cartman here is straight up being a good friend to Butters for the sake of being a good friend, going through the trouble of going to a restaurant to get food Butters genuinely likes without asking the kid anything in return. It might be a small moment, but coming from Cartman, this is big.

As for the second scene, you have the fact that he goes to Butters for emotional support and listens to the kid’s advice, which in a way shows that he values Butters’ opinion on top of seeing him as someone he can confide in.

(And it makes me realize I didn’t mention in “The Magic Bush” how, at the very beginning, Cartman insulted Butters’ bird video but was still able to catch the “drone” part, showing that, to a certain degree, he was listening)

- Safe Space : There’s just a small moment at the beginning I want to talk about. When the episode starts, we have Cartman playing victim and asking PC principal to get a kid to filter the comment section of his social media. Cartman probably knows it’s a very mentally draining task to do.

At first, you have Kyle, Cartman’s worst enemy, who is asked to do it. Then, you have Wendy, who Cartman also butts heads with quite a lot. Finally, you have Butters, who can’t refuse due to his trauma with punishment.

Two things worth noticing here : 1. When Kyle shows up, Cartman tells him he thought about him first. When Wendy shows up, PC Principal says Cartman mentioned her quickly. When Butters shows up, there’s no indication on who called him here.

2. When Butters is asked to do the task, Cartman continues to cry and protests, saying he wanted a smart kid to do it. Now, Cartman did mention with Kyle and possibly Wendy that he knows they’re both organized people who as a result are fit for the job. But at the same time, this is Cartman we’re talking about. He’ll take any opportunity he can to get someone to filter his comments. So him protesting at first about Butters definitely feels a bit odd.

So with both those info in mind, it makes me wonder : who asked for Butters to be in the room ? Did they go through a conga-line of students who said no ? Did PC Principal just go “alright since two refused let’s go with your best friend, see if he agrees” ?

No because the fact that Cartman protests with crocodile tears still in his eyes shows that he’s unhappy about the choice. And given the task at hand + his first two choices being people he despites, it looks like Cartman is trying to defend Butters, to protect him from the task. Coming from Cartman, this is definitely big.

And yes, I know Butters ends up doing the task and Cartman acts shitty towards him. Though, as weak of an argument as it is, Cartman isn’t as bad towards Butters here as he used to be in former episodes. His biggest flaw here is being too self-absorbed to notice Butters’ distress. On top of this, PC Principal being the worst to this poor kid makes Cartman look better in comparison in this specific scenario.

- Tegrity Farms : The last time we’ve seen Cartman and Butters do a “get rich quick” scheme together so far, which gets me very curious as to how their dynamic will be in future schemes (“City People” doesn’t really count since Cartman wanted to do it alone and was more focused on one-upping Liane).

Thing is, aside from the punch at the beginning, Cartman and Butters are the closest we’ve ever seen them to being equals here. Throughout the whole episode, they work in tandem, with Kyle awkwardly following them while trying to stop Cartman. Hell, when Butters confronts Cartman after the punch, he outright says that Cartman referred to the two of them as partners !

Another interesting point is the context behind how Cartman acts here. A while ago, I remember seeing a few people point out how Cartman was the one who told Kyle about Ike smoking, giving off the impression he wanted Kyle to be involved.

Another person pointed out how Cartman relies on Kyle at the end to come up with a plan. So it’s likely he did half-blackmailed half-manipulated Kyle into helping them because Kyle’s a smart cookie.

With that in mind, think of the context we’re given in the episode. Cartman and Butters are apparently in debt. Cartman is the head of the operation, meaning that he’s the one trying to think of a way out of this. And when you think about it, there’s three ways he can go :

1. Continue the same direction, which is risky. Cartman doesn’t like risk if he doesn’t have a way out.

2. Bail and let Butters take the fall.

3. Have a third person in the team, preferably someone smart to help, who could take the fall if it came down to this.

Cartman could’ve gone either solution 2 or 3. But from the looks of it, the beginning of the episode explains why solution 2 isn’t an option unlike in previous episodes. Because, when Cartman throws Butters under the bus here, the kid gets absolutely furious and, were it not for Cartman taking a dumb, he probably would’ve punched him.

And it looks like Cartman realizes it. By that point, Cartman seemingly stopped taking his relationship with Butters for granted and clearly values his help. He also realized that Butters isn’t going to let himself be walked all over anymore, meaning Cartman could lose his friendship if he messes up too much.

So when Cartman finds himself in the situation we see here, instead of dumping every issue on Butters, he takes a third person to throw under the bus, making sure both himself and Butters have a way out.

(This kinda makes me think of how someone also pointed out that, when Kyle confronts the duo at Mackey’s house, Butters admits how Cartman told the 6th graders that Kyle was around. And as he’s talking, Butters is smiling. I’ve seen people question why he’s smiling and all I can imagine is Butters thinking “I’m not the scapegoat this time around !”)

Honestly, this really makes me question how Cartman will act next time the two of them work together to get rich. Is he going to throw Butters under the bus when things get too complicated ? Or is he going to find a third party to use as scapegoat in order to keep Butters happy ?

- Shots : There’s just one very small moment that I still want to point out : after we see the issue of Cartman refusing his shots and how it’s going to cost him public school, we get a scene in the cafeteria with Butters telling the other boys about the first third of the episode.

Basically, Cartman gets homeschooled, hates his new teacher and the first thing he does once the teacher’s gone is calling Butters to bitch about it.

(Which reminds me of S20 with him disliking the GhostBusters movie and warning Butters about it, but in that case it felt like the only reason he texted Butters was due to Butters’ importance this season with the whole “Weiners out” movement. He probably would’ve texted Kenny otherwise)

I guess another thing worth mentioning here is how, within the adults, Stephen is the one taking the lead when it comes to vaccinating Cartman. While surprising to see him step up, it does make sense in the context of the parents being worried that Cartman carrying a disease could affect their own children. Since Cartman and Butters are best friends, Butters is the most at risk.

Although Stephen can go fuck himself with his “no parent wants to see their child hurting” line, given how horrible he is as a parent. And on that note, Liane’s punch was absolutely fantastic (and the only good thing she did in this episode).

- Let Them Eat Goo : Probably the second-best episode from a Cartters POV only, behind Magic Bush. The whole episode just has Cartman being “Butters :D” the whole way through. Seriously.

(Fun fact : I actually saw some random scenes there and there before watching the whole show, one of which being from this episode. So when I stumbled across a clip of the two singing about Sloppy Joe’s, with my only show experience being the first 8 seasons, my first thought was like “So…when did Cartman and Butters become best friends exactly ? How’d that happen ?!”. But then I watched the whole show and yeah, it made more sense.)

The kids’ plot opens with the two of them happily singing about lunch together, which also shows that they don’t just hang out for schemes, they’re actual friends.

Then, when Cartman has his heart attacks, Butters is the only kid who shows genuine concern about it, especially the second time (I’d say it’s pretty sad that only one person cares but at the same time it’s Cartman so fuck him). He’s also the one taking care of Cartman, with Cartman never protesting about it.

In general, Cartman directs all his anger towards the girls and I’m pretty sure he doesn’t insult Butters once here. All he does is wanting to have lunch with the kid and sing about food together.

Even after learning from Butters that the whole school lied to him, he never gets angry at him directly, despite Butters clearly being terrified at the thought of Cartman screaming betrayal at him, which makes sense considering the last time he betrayed Cartman was in “Obama Wins” with Cartman trying to kill him for it.

I could say more about Butters’ fear in this episode but I’m keeping Butters’ POV for the third part of this post.

Lastly, this episode has the third scene of “Cartman trying to be there for Butters emotionally”, and I’d say this one is even bigger than the previous two.

While in the first one (“Informative Murder Porn”), Butters was crying on the ground so it was evident he was suffering, and in the second one (“The Magic Bush”) he explicitly tells Cartman he’s miserable, here, in “Let Them Eat Goo”, Butters doesn’t say a thing. He’s just less enthusiastic than usual.

So not only does Cartman notice, showing he’s been paying attention to Butters and how the kid expresses himself, Cartman also asks by himself if something is bothering Butters !

Cartman, Eric fucking Theodore Cartman, was capable of noticing that something was off about another person, realizing it could be emotional distress and asking the other person about it, very much willing to listen to that person’s problems and see if there’s something he could do about it. Eric Cartman !

Imagine being someone Cartman tries to comfort and being there to listen vent. Let’s just say you gotta be pretty special for this kid to be like that.

And another thing about it, though it could just be due to the camera moving from one character to the other at each line : everytime Butters is done talking, Cartman seems to take a second before replying, as if making sure Butters said everything he wanted to say/trying to avoid interrupting Butters. But again, it could also just be due to the camera shifting from one to the other.

In any case, we get to see Cartman noticing emotional distress and being willing to lend an ear without being judgmental/mocking or using it as future blackmail. Coming from Cartman, this is really big.

And when you think about it, Cartman actually hasn’t ripped on Butters in quite a while, or at least not to the same extent he used to.

- City People : Not a lot to say here aside from the fact that, while their interactions are short, they’re pretty wholesome (way too wholesome from someone like Cartman).

First off, Cartman shows up at Butters’ house with a saddened expression, telling Butters he needs his help as if asking “do you have time right now ?”, or at least it can be read that way.

Also, compare that to the Christian band episode or “Go God Go”. In both those instances, Cartman shows up with a serious expression, tells Butters “I need you for X right now so do Y” without giving him the choice and then expects the kid to do the task without question. In “City People”, he’s being a lot softer and opens up very easily.

Then, Cartman doesn’t mind the physical contact as comfort (until Butters says something that bothers Cartman) and is quick to tell Butters everything, trusting him to keep it secret.

He also compliments Butters’ photography skills, which is a pretty big compliment coming from someone who sees photography as an art (as we see mostly in “Cartman Sucks”. Yeah I know, not the best episode to talk about in a Cartters post but you gotta do what you gotta do).

Btw Cartman had literally no reason to compliment Butters, the kid was already willing to help him. He just gave out a sincere compliment because he felt like it.

Finally, you have the commercial filming scene. When Cartman enters Clyde’s house, he comments on the size and asks Butters’ opinion on it. Thing is, I feel like, was this episode made in an earlier season, Cartman wouldn’t have asked Butters’ opinion or would’ve told him to shut it had he spoken. But here, Cartman wants Butters’ opinion in the video. He wants to include Butters.

- Credigree Weed St Patrick’s Day Special : Not a lot here either aside from two small moments.

First, you have that scene with Butters being the only kid giving a shit about the holiday. But despite visibly not caring, Cartman still says something positive about it to Butters, possibly to make the kid happy instead of ruining his enthusiasm.

In a way, it reminds me of “Nightmare on Face Time”, with Kenny and Cartman stumbling across Butters and Jimmy, Cartman taking interest in Butters’ clothing and, despite clearly finding the costume shitty, Cartman still says something positive about it. And when he says something sarcastic to Kenny about it, it doesn’t come off as mean spirited or mocking, like he's not saying it and then laughing about it. He’s playing nice to Butters, just like in the St Patrick’s Day episode.

The second moment is the prison scene with the main 4 using the opportunity to visit Butters. Here, Cartman’s the first one to talk, asking Butters how the holiday’s treating him (I guess Cartman doesn’t want to ask “are you okay ?” in public out of pride or something) and lets out an unconvinced “cool” after Butters answers him.

Also, it might be just due to them being closer to the bars but Stan and Cartman take a second longer to turn around in comparison to Kyle and Kenny. Also also, Cartman spends the whole episode sounding dead inside, and him asking Butters how he’s doing is the only time there’s some emotion in his voice.

(Side note : I kinda love how Cartman clearly doesn’t care about the holiday but still dresses up for the occasion. He’s just that extra)

On top of this evolution with Cartman softening up over time, I’ve seen people point out how Cartman is a lot more patient towards Butters than towards any other kid.

There are many instances in the show, I think mostly starting around S12-13, where Butters says something and Cartman reacts with mild annoyance, sighing and rolling his eyes before moving on

Examples include the deleted scene of “The Tale of Scrotie Mcboogerballs” (or at least I think it’s from this episode. It’s the thing with the main 5 + Jimmy and Ike making a sentence with random gross words), the garden of betrayal scene in the Black Friday trilogy or their exchange around the middle of “Dead Kids”, to name a few. Were it any other kid, Cartman would be yelling in those scenes.

Along with that, Cartman lets Butters get away with a lot.

The best examples are the kiss from “Tonsil Trouble” or literally everything about “The Magic Bush”, the latter also showing that, whereas Cartman tends to yell back when someone angry is confronting him (unless the person is visibly stronger/more dangerous in which case he knows to be careful), when it comes to Butters specifically, all he does is gently repeat Butters’ name until the kid calms down.

We see him do it in “A Song of Ass and Fire” and “Where my Country Gone” as well. Btw in that last episode, during the whole scene of Cartman trying to find a Canadian girl for Butters, Cartman acts in a very gentle manner and it’s pretty sweet.

In that last episode, it’s also pretty funny how Cartman, who has been shown to be quite the romantic (“Cartman Finds Love”, “Tweek X Craig”) suddenly doesn’t have time for a slow romance when Butters is involved in it.

Oh yeah and fun fact, in “Let Them Eat Goo”, we see Butters trying to calm down Cartman by gently repeating his name, copying what Cartman does with him.

Another good episode showing Cartman being a softie is the beginning of “Going Native”, which is honestly very funny.

First off, you have Cartman seeing Butters beat the shit out of Scott before locking himself in the bathroom, and Cartman goes on to tell the other boys about it, as if asking them for help.

Then Butters goes home and has a talk with his parents and, when we go back to the kids after school, they’re all playing outside until Cartman shows up, yet again talking about Butters. This implies that, when school ended, the first thing Cartman did was check on the kid (I mean they were next-door neighbors back then so I guess it wasn’t that big of a trip). And again, he seems to be asking the others for help.

It’s also worth noting that Butters apparently called him fat, which is something that not only usually makes Cartman go berserk (Tenorman, the therapist, that one kid he locked to a pole etc) but is also something Butters almost never says, unlike for example the “fatass” insult Stan and Kyle used often enough for Cartman to now let it slide. After all, we know from early seasons that he clearly hates the “fatass” nickname. He only lets it slide because he’s used to it despite hating it.

But yeah, despite the “fat” insult, Cartman still wants to help Butters.

And the funniest part of this : when Kyle tells Kenny to go help Butters, Cartman gets all passive-aggressive about Kenny’s help, calling him “mister perfect” and telling him to “rescue Butters”. It makes Cartman sound so jealous ! And even Kyle then raises a curious eyebrow, as if wondering what the hell just went through Cartman’s head ! I love this moment and how dumb it is !

Yet another random thing I didn’t mention in the episodes list is “Sarcastaball”, with Cartman being supportive of Butters and going to him for advice.

And no I’m not including the cum joke as proof of them being close. Sure, it’s a sex joke between the two, which are kinda starting to pile up when you think about it, but in context neither of them knew what it was. Also the other kids drink it as well so…

To finish up with this part, here’s some of my thoughts on Post-Covid Cartman + a few interesting things about his interactions with Butters/Vic :

First off all, know that I have no pity for Cartman. I know he’s a child raised in a bad environment and whose mental illnesses make him highly struggle with empathy/sympathy/compassion.

But at the same time, literally one of the main jokes about SP is the kids being the smart ones, especially compared to the adults. When Cartman commits a crime, he knows what he’s doing, he just doesn’t care. Hell, why do you think he’s always making sure to have a way to escape consequences ?

Ultimately, the only thing I feel bad about when it comes to Cartman is the one thing he has no control over : His family life.

Him being raised by a single mom who should have never been a parent to begin with, on top of not only having an absent father but also losing the only father figure he ever had (Chef). After watching “City People” (and being disappointed by Liane’s final choice), I actually wanted to make a post about the Cartmans. Not sure if I’ll ever write it but in any case I’d rather wait until I watch “Streaming Wars” anyways in order to have more to talk about.

With that in mind, regarding Cartman’s fate in Post-Covid, I don’t feel bad about him being homeless. Sure, I was surprised that someone like him wasn’t able to become successful since Cartman’s the kind of person who will succeed, no matter how little he deserves it (we sure live in a society), but still, I don’t feel bad.

It’s actually pretty interesting tho how a show that usually goes with the “realistic approach” in how characters are handled suddenly decided to give Cartman what he deserves, not what someone so corrupted would realistically have.

Oh and don’t go telling me Cartman redeemed himself, because he sure as hell didn’t ! If he was reformed, he would’ve acknowledged all the horrible shit he did as a kid, especially to Kyle, and then apologize for it. But instead, he swept it all under the rug and acted like a victim when he was rightfully called out on it.

And he kept that victim mentality throughout the entire special, changing the narrative to make Kyle look bad, and some people actually bought into this act and talked shit about Kyle after the special aired ! Like guys ! This is Cartman we’re talking about here !

And let’s not forget how he spent the entirety of the first special messing with Kyle by bringing up his Judaism at any chance. Also, while his family do seem to be good people, it’s obvious that they’re not that great.

I mean, first off Yentl seems to have a bad impression of Kyle right off the bat, showing that Cartman lied to her about his childhood to make the guy look bad.

Then, when they show up at Kyle’s doorstep, Yentl tells the kids that everything’s going to be alright before Kyle agrees to house them (btw Cartman using his family to make Kyle feel bad and house them).

The kids are also shown to have a victim mentality, likely spread by Cartman, and are all shown to swear, including the baby. And sure, all the kids in SP swear, but still.

Plus, one of the kids is overweight which, most of the time, is a sign of negligence, especially for a kid that young (he seems to be around 7-8).

Again, I do believe that Cartman’s wife and kids are good people. But they’re definitely not perfect and we can see Cartman’s influence on them.

Oh and another thing I’d like to point out because it bothers me a bit : no, Cartman technically did not sacrifice his family. Cartman’s family sacrificed themselves.

Cartman was still arguing about saving them and killing Kyle, and it’s Yentl and the kids who convinced him to give up on this plan.

They’re the one who told Cartman it was okay, they’re the ones who promised that there was still a chance for them to meet in another timeline. It wasn’t all Cartman’s idea to sacrifice them, it was Yentl and the kids who stepped up and told Cartman that things were going to be alright, no matter what changes could be brought to the past. Had they not convinced Cartman to agree with Stan and Kyle, Cartman would’ve gone ahead with his original plan.

Long story short : Adult Cartman is still the same monster he was as a kid, he’s just better at hiding it.

Ultimately, the only genuine thing about him is his love for his family. It’s the only part where he seemed truly honest. Everything else, he was just using people.

Heck I’ve seen people point out how his conversion to Judaism could be due to his former views on Kyle that might have led him to fetishize the religion or use it as a way to cope after “losing Kyle”, things like that.

Now, with the “Cartman is the worst” rant out of the way, here’s a few interesting things about how Cartman and Butters/Vic interact in the bathroom scene :

1. The fact that Cartman was able to find Vic more easily than Stan and Kyle despite searching for a shorter time actually makes a lot of sense. Stan and Kyle just went where the destruction happened and tried to follow the general direction of where Vic was last seen.

Cartman on the other hand is a con artist, just like Vic. So he probably asked himself “If I wanted to scam people easily, where would I go ?” and immediately knew where Vic was.

2. I’ve seen people point out in a youtube comments section how Cartman is the only one who was able to “break” the persona Vic created of himself and bring back the old Butters, shown by the “Oh Hamburgers”.

I think the explanation suggested was that Cartman was able to see through Vic’s mask due to being a liar with a fake personality himself.

3. Kind of a side note really but looking at this scene, I feel like this is the moment Vic recognized Stan and Kyle. Like, earlier in the asylum, he went over their names very quickly and probably wasn’t much interested in them to begin with anyways.

But in this scene, he very much recognized Cartman, and there’s only one Kyle that Cartman is obsessed with. So I feel like Cartman mentioning Kyle is when Vic made the connection between the “Stand and Kyle” guys who knew his child nickname and the Kyle Cartman hates so much and wants to kill.

4. Something pretty funny : the fact that Cartman at the very least knows that Vic was in an asylum, meaning he’s dangerous to a certain degree, and yet Cartman has no issue immediately telling him about how he’s trying to save his wife and kids.

Like, Cartman, buddy, the guy in front of you is incredibly dangerous and possibly holds a huge against you from all the shit you did to him as a kid. Why are you telling him your weak point you absolute moron ?

Idk, it just amuses me that Cartman still confides in Vic so easily despite how long it’s been since the last time they saw each other.

5. Throughout both specials, we see three sides of Cartman : his “love my family” side, his “nice rabbi persona” side that he uses to manipulate others, and his “true selfish” side, which is when he acts like he did as a kid.

For most scenes, he plays nice until pushed to a point where his true side comes out, the best example being his fight with Kyle in the church. But in that bathroom scene, Cartman doesn’t hide behind any persona.

When he confronts Vic, he talks exactly the same way he did when they were kids. It’s the only time in the whole episode where he doesn’t even try to pretend to be anyone else but himself. And sure, it can be seen as a scare tactic, bringing back Vic’s trauma to scare him into helping. But at the same time, it is pretty interesting how the only time Cartman acts without a mask is when alone with Vic.

Alright, that was all I had to say about the evolution of their friendship and whatnot. If you’re still here and reading, I promise the other two parts aren’t as long and I’m sorry this turned out to be so big. I like rambling and get too passionate about stuff ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

2. The duo’s sexualities and genders (and how Cartman is obsessive)

So, let’s start off by talking about Cartman’s sexuality.

Basically, I’m pretty convinced that he’s bi/pan, and I’m pretty sure it’s canon at that point ?

Like, you had several instances throughout the show of him showing attraction to both guys and gals, with my favorite example being “Le Petite Tourette” due to him admitting in the same scene that he has a crush on a girl and touched dicks with one of his cousins (though the latter does raise the question of how old was the other cousin and as a result how consensual the action was…).

And then you have “Tweek X Craig” with a whole side plot of him denying his attraction to guys, only to cave in at the end. So doesn’t that mean he’s canon queer ?

(btw I’d like to point out that in this episode you also have Stan being pretty focused on Tweek and Craig’s relationship. While the other boys were just surprised but then moved on, Stan spends the whole episode asking questions like “what make people gay ?” and “if it happened to them, can it happen to me ?” Due to that, I tend to believe that Stan’s canon sexuality is questioning)

Something else worth pointing out in this episode : in general, Cartman is a huge bigot. We all know that (and looking at the episodes he shares with Tolkien, I sometimes wonder if he even views Tolkien as a human being. That’s how much of a bigot he is).

But in “The Hobbit”, we see him partly defending Lisa Burger after the boys made fun of her for her weight, though he follows by insulting her looks. So from this, we can assume that Cartman is a bigot towards everyone but fat people, because he himself is fat.

Well guess what about “Tweek X Craig” : After the first montage, we see Cartman think about their relationship, with Cupid him showing up, and Cartman proceeds to say something along the lines of “Just because I don’t understand it doesn’t mean I have to be against it”. Carmtan. Eric fucking Cartman said that !

So the fact that Cartman isn’t intolerant towards gay couples, the same way he isn’t intolerant towards fat people, does raise questions as to how he feels towards guys.

Although, to me, the biggest proof of Cartman’s bisexuality/pansexuality is his obsession with both Kyle and Butters. But I’m going to develop it a few lines down.

Ultimately, I feel like Cartman is either bi or pan.

He’s aware that he’s attracted to guys, though he tries to deny it. At the same time, I don’t think he realizes that the way he acts towards Kyle and Butters could be due to some form of attraction, though I can’t really bring myself to see his current “attraction” to Kyle and Butters as romantic. But it’s still a form of attraction nonetheless.

As for Cartman’s gender, I do think he’s cis, though he absolutely enjoys women clothes. But thing is, whenever he cross-dresses, it’s for show (the “insufferable teenage girl” thing in S6, the clip in “Butterballs”, a persona in “W.T.F”, him singing and dancing in “Awesome-O”). So I’d say he’s more of a drag queen rather than genderfluid, tho I do like the genderfluid headcanon.

Furthermore, in “The Cissy”, Cartman pretends to be a trans girl for bathroom privileges. And in that one occasion where he has to pretend to be a girl on a daily basis, he only does the bare minimum, putting a bow on while continuing to show his masculinity.

The fact that this instance in particular is the one time he doesn’t put any effort in his appearance is what leads me to believe that he’s cis, though gender non-conforming for sure.

Now, for Cartman’s obsessions with Kyle and Butters, because this is honestly something I find incredibly interesting but I don’t want to make too many posts so you’ll have to suffer through reading about it here. I’m going to try keeping this as short as possible by just explaining how Cartman expresses those obsessions and some differences I find interesting.

- Cartman’s obsession with Kyle is mostly shown through him being a stalker.

He once said he sneaks into Kyle’s room on the regular (tbh “kid shows up uninvited into another kid’s bedroom” is pretty common in SP), in a deleted scene of “Naughty Ninjas” he admits to having recorded every discussion he has had with Kyle for a whole year in case he gets blackmail material, and there are three scenes in which we see him being able to predict what Kyle is going to say (“Kenny Dies” I think when he sends Butters to talk to Stan and Kyle, I think “Obama Wins” with Cartman calling Kyle while he’s talking to Ike and guessing what Kyle was talking about, and a deleted scene from “Grounded Vindaloop” with a phone call between Kyle and Butters)

A result of that which we often see is Cartman’s ability to manipulate Kyle. If Cartman wants Kyle to do something, he will get Kyle to do it. Cartman knows exactly which buttons to press to get Kyle to act a certain way and is capable of using this on the regular.

I could say more about this but this post is already way too long so I’m putting it in the Ky//man part of the “my opinion on other ships” bonus at the very end. Expect negativity though.

- When it comes to Butters, there are three things that could be related to Cartman being obsessed with him. From least creepy to most creepy :

1. Butters easily comes to Cartman’s mind. Like in “Fishsticks” when he keeps imagining new scenarios in his head and, whenever someone who wasn’t on the scene shows up, it’s always Butters first. Or how in early seasons he was already often asking Butters for help despite kids like Clyde being around.

(btw, just wanted to say I’m always surprised when I see people say that Butters is the kid who acts the most like a kid when Clyde is right there. I mean come on ! Clyde is the definition of “awkward, impressionable and kind of a loser” kid. Especially in newer seasons in which Butters is a lot more unhinged and corrupted)

2. Sort of a continuation but in early seasons, Cartman was very focused on pranking Butters specifically. Compare that to Scott Malkinson, who some people call “the new Butters” due to his status as bottom of the social ladder. Cartman doesn’t give a shit about Scott and never goes out of his way to prank him.

3. Cartman has a huge fixation on Butters’ body, in particular his dick. We can see it through not only his tendency to have Butters either naked or cross-dressing during his schemes, but also a few instances of him trying to take a peek of Butters’ dick like in “Proper Condom Use” or even more recently with “Return of Covid” with how he interrupts Vic mid-piss. Another good example is “T.M.I”.

Then you also have some creepy behavior like him smelling Butters’ underwear in “Stunning and Brave” (btw last time I watched this scene I noticed that Cartman bites his lip while sniffing. Like, please don’t ever do that again kid) or “Cartman Sucks” in which, while I agree that Cartman was doing what he did to humiliate Butters, given his track record, I’d argue it says something that the first thing that came to his mind was putting Butters’ dick in his mouth of all things.

On that same note, when talking about how privacy is gone in “The Magic Bush”, he mentions “your wiener, my balls”. And given how often he talks about his balls (especially when negotiating) + his track record with Butters’ dick, it does make me wonder if the choice of words here was deliberate.

I’ve also seen a post half-jokingly theorize that Cartman might find Butters’ body attractive, and honestly it does hold water.

The idea is due to the episodes “Douch and Turd” and “Canada on Strike”, both of which have a scene with Cartman using Butters’ body as a way to attract people to his cause. I’d say “Canada on Strike” especially due to some naked shots in the “What What in The Butt” clip + the fact that at some point during the clip we see Stan and later on Cartman sitting on a chair in front of the computer. Compared to Stan, Cartman is really leaning towards the screen.

And yeah, between those two instances and the way Cartman in general tries to get Butters naked or look at his dick, it does give the impression that he finds Butters attractive.

And in the case of the two episodes mentioned, maybe he assumes that everyone finds Butters attractive since Cartman is still struggling with his sexuality. Basically, he may not realize that he’s physically attracted to Butters so he simply believes that Butters is good-looking.

Btw, I insist on the “physically attracted”. I’m not calling it romantic love in any way. If anything, it’s Cartman liking Butters body but being too much of a mess to know how to express this attraction in a healthy way. All he knows is that he likes looking at Butters’ body, so he tries to do it as often as possible.

(And I have to be honest, for a while I thought he had calmed down on that aspect. But looking at the Covid special, he really didn’t. It’s just that now that he and Butters are friends, he can’t go around asking the boy to strip. Hell, Butters has enough confidence now to say no and even maybe tell him to fuck off.)

- On top of those, both kids were victim of sexual harassment and sexual abuse from Cartman, showing how far those obsessions can get. And while you do have instances like “Cartman Sucks” and “Imaginationland” in which Cartman doesn’t seem to realize he’s doing something sexual or at the very least isn’t doing it with sexual intent in mind, it doesn’t excuse the fact that he’s sexually harassing and assaulting those kids.

Then there’s also for example Cartman’s journal in “Fractured But Whole”. From what I remember, there are four sexual drawings and every single of contains either Kyle or Butters in it. I think one of them also depicts Butters with a large dick but I’m not sure and I don’t really want to check that detail, for obvious reasons.

Another thing he possibly does with both is physical contact. Like, in general Cartman is a pretty touchy person, but he kinda feels extra touchy towards Kyle and Butters specifically I think ?

As a result of all that, I tend to interpret Cartman’s views on them as some sort of non-sexual lust, if that’s even a thing that exists.

- Finally, I find it very interesting how, despite both being kids Cartman obsesses over, the way he views them and acts towards them is incredibly different.

To keep it short : when Cartman wants someone to mess with or to blame for his issues/be paranoid about, he goes to Kyle. When Cartman seeks emotional support and someone he can trust and confide into but also work on good terms with, he seeks Butters. Basically, he thrives off of Kyle’s negative attention and Butters’ positive attention. Idk, I just find this interesting.

Oh and one last thing that I’ve seen being mentioned for Butters in a few fics and it’s incredibly fucked up but at the same time very much in character coming from Cartman : the fact that Cartman is a n*zi, Kyle is Jewish and Butters is blond with possibly blue eyes, aka what a n*zi would call an “aryan”.

So the two kids that Cartman is obsessed over are what he considers to be the worst in humanity and the best in humanity. I both hate this info and find it really interesting from a characters’ POV.

And on a side note, this could also explain his fixation on Butters’ body, in a very, very messed up way.

Now, a few words about Butters’ sexuality because we’re here to talk about a relationship after all : Tbh, I’m not really sure if Butters is straight or bi/pan ? Like, he absolutely finds women attractive, that’s not even a question.

But when it comes to guys, I see people say that he has bi tendencies but they don’t bring up any examples and the only thing I can think of are the “bi-curious” jokes, in which I’m not even sure Butters knows what he’s talking about ?

Does anybody remember any instances of Butters showing a liking for guys, aside from calling himself bi-curious/bike-curious or looking gay due to Cartman being obsessed with him ? I’m genuinely curious here.

And no, the other characters calling him gay as an insult doesn’t count. That’s not even something I’ll use to justify Stan’s sexuality despite thinking he’s questioning it.

(For those who are likely confused as to how I can ship Cartters if I don’t see Butters as bi/pan : basically I’m the type to stick with canon, probably a little too much, so I like when my headcanons are backed up by canon. But if Butters turns out to be straight in the show, it won’t stop me from seeing him as bi in fanon even if it’s not canon-compliant)

As for Butters’ gender, I believe he’s cis.

Speaking of which, because I feel the need to talk about it : my biggest pet peeve about the fandom has to be how popular the “character” of Ma//jorine is.

Now don’t get me wrong, I get it. Butters is a popular character and people project their own gender euphoria on him because they have a golden opportunity to do so. Trust me, I’ve been there (*cough* trans Vin//nie Dako//ta *cough*). On top of that, I’m sure many people simply enjoy her design.

And even without all that in mind, in terms of trans headcanons, I absolutely love the idea of Princess Kenny being a trans woman in a SOT AU. So I’m really not one to talk and can’t blame people for simply having headcanons.

But it doesn’t change the fact that there are things about Ma//jorine that bother me and even make me uncomfortable, though that’s very much a “me” problem.

Let me explain (this whole part is going to be in italics so it’s easy to skip if you don’t want to listen to a negative rant about her. And yeah I know this could’ve been its own thing but I’m not making a post just to talk shit about a harmless headcanon) :

- Starting with the biggest problem and the one thing that makes me genuinely uncomfortable : Cartman.

To put it simply, Butters has cross-dressed on three occasions in the show. In “Douche and Turd” with Cartman making him dance the hula, in “Ma//jorine” with the boys sending a spy amongst the girls due to Cartman thinking they have a future-telling device, and the Superheroes trilogy with Cartman forcing Butters to dress up as Courtney Love and take suggestive pictures with a naked homeless man.

You might notice a pattern.

Every single time Butters cross-dressed, it had to do with one of Cartman’s schemes. Worse, the last one (Courtney Love) had Butters protest about it on top of having the other boys calling the plan “taking naked pictures of Butters”.

To keep it short and to the point : we know Cartman is fixated on Butters body + Cartman struggles with his sexuality. In other words, it’s not Butters who enjoys wearing women’s clothes, it’s Cartman who enjoys seeing Butters in those.

And that’s why it’s making me uncomfortable. When I see art of Ma//jorine, instead of thinking about Butters expressing himself, all I can think of is Cartman preying on this poor kid.

Also, regarding the episode “Ma//jorine” itself, I’m part of the “Butters was uncomfortable the whole time” crowd.

Like, 1. He was clearly stressed and uncomfortable with the plan.

2. The line “You don’t know how hard it is to be me” doesn’t have to do with his gender (tho I can understand why people resonate with it) but with the fact that this is early seasons Butters. He’s a victim to everyone else. So of course it’s hard to be him ! Imagine having such a childhood !

3. Him having so much fun with the girls yet again comes from the fact that literally nobody likes him, so of course he’s going to latch onto the very first group that’s kind enough to accept him.

4. Once he leaves the party, the first thing he does is throw the wig away.

Ultimately, the only time Butters expressed desires to wear feminine clothes is in “The Cissy” with the tutu at the end, plus the fact that he casually mentions how he’s holding his pee now because the bathroom situation confuses him. But I don’t think those instances are ever brought up again ?

- Something that isn’t an issue exclusive to Butters and can be found in pretty much any fandom anyways : character feminization.

Basically, the fact that people still try to put heteronormative ideas into gay couples, causing one of them to be the “man” and the other the “woman” of the relationship. As a result, some characters get their personalities completely messed with in a very bad way, especially the characters who end up feminized.

Again, that’s not an SP-exclusive issue. Literally every fandom has this problem. And while the SP fandom is old and apparently knows better nowadays, there are still posts circulating about the feminization of Kyle, Butters and Tweek.

Basically, for Butters, you have the issue of “Kenny and Cartman are much manlier than Butters so surely he’s the woman in the relationship !” As a result, some people seem to use Ma//jorine as an excuse to make Butters be even more of a girl, which is pretty messed up.

Tbh, I don’t blame the fans of Ma//jorine for this, as this is clearly a minority. Plus, a while ago on the main SP tag, there have been a lot of Bu//nny posts that had both Kenny and Butters wear women’s clothing, in which case I don’t see any issue since both are shown as more feminine.

All-in-all, I think the biggest issue with Butters is the fact that both Cartman and Kenny had been seen willingly wearing women’s clothes and enjoying it. And yet Butters, the kid that was forced into those clothes, is the one who gets feminized. Again, it definitely stems from heteronormativity, with those people not understanding that guys can be both masculine and feminine.

Also, guys, a man can take the lead in a relationship and be more masculine while at the same time being gender non-conforming or even being a bottom. Because that’s another issue people have with heteronormativity (I’m talking generally with that last one. I’m not one to age-up characters so I don’t want to think about SP kids and sex stuff . I don’t care that the show itself put those kids in sex situations, it’s still uncomfortable to watch).

- For those who like her mostly due to her design : there’s that background girl character in the show called Kelly Pinkerton-Tinfurter. It’s that blonde girl with two pigtails, a pink shirt and a scarf.

For the longest time, before learning her name, I called this girl “Ma//jorine-haired girl”. Because let’s be real, while not identical, the hair is pretty similar. You can probably guess where I’m going with this.

For those who like Ma//j for the design only, what about Kelly ? Heck, you can give her more than the one pair of clothes she has in the show. And you can draw her without her pigtails as well (hope this doesn’t come off as condescending since that’s not the intention here…I’m very much aware that using Kelly isn’t the same as using Butters. But at the same time, I find it to be a good compromise).

Another good thing about using Kelly as Ma//jorine would be the personality.

Whenever people draw Ma//j, it kinda feels like they’re taking Butters’ early seasons personality and add a feminine touch to it. But Butters has gone through major character development throughout the show and is now very different from the kid he used to be in S8-9.

(Imma be honest, I never read a single fic with Ma//j in it, so I really can’t speak for how she’s characterized in fics. But looking at fanart, she does tend to give a “Butters’ pre-development self” vibe)

Oh and Butters also turned out incredibly misogynistic, which I should’ve point out earlier when talking about him not being comfortable with cross-dressing but anyways.

So yeah, Kelly as a character is a blank slate. All we know is she’s a girl and likes board games. You could easily give her Butters’ early seasons personality and make it more feminine. And that way, you can even have both Butters and Ma//j exist at the same time.

(also, hope it doesn’t come off as rude but isn’t it usually a fandom thing to focus on side characters, using the fact that they’re a blank state to flesh them out and make them actual characters ?)

Lastly, regarding the trans headcanons, because I’m very much aware that the main appeal of Ma//j is the trans rep : what if Kelly was a trans girl as well ?

At some point while thinking about Kelly, I looked up the boys at school and found out about “unnamed blond boy with red shirt”

Remember the early seasons episode with the kids in the bus stuck on a cliff ? That boy is the kid who leaves the bus and gets eaten. Apparently, that was his only appearance in the show. But since the whole episode turns out to be a dream within a dream, maybe he’s still alive ?

On top of that, I found out that, while Kelly’s first appearance was in “Stupid Spoiled Whore”, which was one season before “Ma//jorine”, she had very little background appearances between her first appearance and “Ma//j” and shows up a lot more afterwards. Oh and she’s conveniently not there in “Ma//jorine”, which I’m guessing is due to design similarities.

So here’s my idea for Kelly : she’s amab who never felt like she fit in with the other boys, hence why we never see her. Then “Ma//jorine” happens and seeing Butters in those clothes give Kelly major gender envy. So she starts growing her hair more, feeling also confident about “imitating” Ma//j due to the fact that the girl mysteriously disappeared after a few days, so it’s not like they’ll run into each other.

Once she feels confident enough in her looks, she starts trying to socialize with a few girls who accept her. You could also imagine that she already had a few “unpopular” girl friends (by unpopular I mean “not part of the main girl group we usually see”) with who she felt a lot more at home than with other boys. Plus, those friends encouraged her to express her gender.

Eventually, she introduces herself to the more popular girls as Kelly and becomes part of the group. Though, it’d be funny if some of the girls thought she was Ma//jorine who came back after a few months, with Kelly playing along because Ma//j was only around for like a week max so it’s not like she pretends to be the girls’ life-long friend or something. This idea of using the Ma//j nickname does feel a bit like shitting on Ma//j tho.

(You know, on one hand, this is low-key making me consider writing a oneshot about Kelly. But on the other hand, I’m not very big on side characters, including Kelly, so it would feel more like something written to spite people who like Ma//jorine rather than an actual desire to flesh out a side character. So I doubt I’ll ever write anything about her transitioning. If I ever make a long story that has several side characters, I’d absolutely include her as part of the side cast tho.)

So, very long story short : my main issue with Ma//j is that the way she’s used feels like Butters’ core personality is taken away for a more shy and feminine version of the character, on top of “validating” some of Cartman’s fucked up views. And the fact that there’s a side character that could perfectly fit the mold makes this impression worse.

3. How the two view each other and how their relationship could evolve

Alright, so with sexuality and gender out of the way, let’s talk a little more about how the two currently see each other and how it can evolve (not me just realizing now how useless the second part of this post actually is…).

As of right now, the two consider each other to be best friends.

First off all, I actually really like how their relationship evolved in a “natural” way, if I can say.

What I mean is that, usually, relationships reach a point where they have to talk things out in order to move in a better direction or understand each other’s boundaries. Just look at Stan and Kyle for example and how their relationship grew resentful as the two kept sweeping everything under the rug (please do yourself a favor and go read some analysis about Stan and Kyle’s friendship. There’s tons of interesting stuff !).

But with Cartman and Butters, their friendship grew without much talk. They’re just two guys who kept hanging out and eventually grew attached to each other. Butters is competent for schemes so Cartman kept him around. Then Cartman started opening up to him and Butters proved himself trustworthy. And now, Cartman is trying to return the favor.

Although, I do think that at some point, these two will hit a wall and will need to talk things off. Because when you look at their relationship on an emotional level, it’s actually pretty one-sided, on Cartman’s end.

Cartman puts tons of faith into Butters and trusts him pretty much blindly. I’m not sure if this is due to him being paranoid that leads him to trust one specific person, but in any case, the trust is here. Cartman confides in Butters, trusts him during their schemes and goes to him for emotional support.

But Butters on the other hand…he just doesn’t. Hell, looking at the three scenes of Cartman showing emotional support : “Informative Murder Porn”, Butters is crying on the ground so he didn’t ask anybody to try and comfort him ; “The Magic Bush”, Butters told Cartman he was miserable as a way to scold him ; “Let Them Eat Goo”, Butters didn’t say a thing and it’s Cartman who notices that something’s wrong.

Honestly, the more I think about it, the more it looks like Butters trusts Cartman the same way the other boys do, which is “Cartman is absolutely incredible at coming up with schemes and knows what he’s doing, so if you need a leader/schemer to help you, you should seek his help. But for anything else, fuck him.”

Now obviously, Butters does consider Cartman to be his best friend and his attached to him. Just look at his reaction to the heart attacks in “Let Them Eat Goo”. There’s evident concern here (especially compared to like the ending of “Pee” or that one moment in “Stick of Truth” where you have to heal Cartman and Butters is like “how about we let him suffer a little longer ?”).

Also, smaller moment but I never saw anyone point it out : in “Naughty Ninjas”, when the boys want to get rid of Cartman and make a vote, everyone move their heads while agreeing, except for Butters, who as a result likely decided to side with Cartman instead, hence him not moving during the vote.

Another thing regarding Butters’ side and him being attached to Cartman, as weird as it is to say : him being around Cartman is a pretty good thing for the kid. Because Butters is unhinged and full of rage from his parents’ bullshit (to put it lightly). As a result, hanging out with Cartman not only gives him an outlet to express the mean/angry side of him, but Cartman is also able to prevent Butters from going apeshit, at least sometimes.

And I think that’s also why Butters considers Cartman his best friend. Cartman is someone Butters can be at his worst with. Given his family situation, it’s probably freeing for him, making him feel a bit more in control of his life.

But while Butters genuinely cares and likes Cartman, he still doesn’t trust him (rightfully so honestly). More than that, Butters is still terrified of Cartman. Recent examples show that, like the second half of “Let Them Eat Goo” and his scene in “City People” (when Cartman pushes Butters’ hand away, Butters keeps his hand close to his chest in a defensive way, before dropping it since Cartman doesn’t show any sign of aggressivity).

Tbh, I absolutely adore that we get to see Butters be so scared of Cartman still. I think it has to do with the fact that obviously Butters should be scared of Cartman after all the horrible shit the boy put him through.

And what I like about it is that, being a comedy show and all, Matt and Trey could’ve easily just gone “well they’re best friends now so Butters isn’t scared anymore”. But instead, they acknowledge that Butters was traumatized and, as a result, is still afraid of Cartman.

On that note, I really hope that “Butters is scared of Cartman while Cartman keeps acting friendly towards him” is a thing we’ll keep having in future episodes.

It’s honestly really great in “Let Them Eat Goo” to see Butters being so worried about Cartman calling him a traitor, only for Cartman to spend the entire episode being friendly with him. I just really like the evolution of Butters’ fear in this episode and how he slowly calms down the more he realizes that Cartman won’t hurt him. It’s very endearing to see.

But yeah, going back to that “they’ll need to sit down and talk at some point”, this is what I mean.

Butters was heavily traumatized by all the horrible shit Cartman put him through (made worse when you consider that what led Butters to get so close to Cartman in the first place is the fact that his parents are incredibly controlling, so of course an authority figure like Cartman would allure him).

At some point, Cartman will have to realize that what he did wasn’t ok, and that Butters isn’t going to just forgive him like that. Cartman is on a good path right now but he needs to keep going if he wants that friendship to be healthy. Cartman also really needs to be called out for his creepy predatory behavior.

This whole thing is also why I like to imagine Cartters as one-sided on Cartman’s end. As someone who isn’t particularly fond of portraying abusive relationships, I’m really not a fan of the idea of Butters liking his bully without the bully actually acknowledging his actions. I feel like it also undermines Cartman’s abuse by having Butters forgive him every time in the name of love or something.

(Don’t get me wrong, I can still genuinely appreciate Cartters fics that don’t really go there, but I do feel like Cartman is let off a little too easily most of the time. Then again, most fics take place in their teenage years so I can sorta understand that feeling of “it’s all behind them now”, tho I still wish there was more acknowledgment.)

Oh yeah and a few other reasons why I like one-sided Cartters with Cartman being in love :

- I like portraying characters as disasters and Cartman being a bi disaster who also struggles to accept his sexuality is very endearing

- Cartman liking someone who doesn’t like him back makes him miserable. I like when Cartman is miserable

- Butters doesn’t strike me as being in love with Cartman in the show, especially due to the episode “Scause for Applause”. In this episode, Butters acts as Stan’s hype man and pretty much acts the same way he does with Cartman, save for having a bit less admiration. So if he views Stan in a platonic way, he views Cartman in a platonic way. And given all the hurt Cartman caused him, it would take quite a few years for romantic feelings to grow.

All of that is also why I said in the intro that I don’t want this ship to be canon as of now and would rather see their friendship grow healthier. Especially since I do believe it could get better if the show wanted to go that direction.

After all, if you were to show someone who doesn’t know shit about SP the seasons 17-25 and asked them to describe the duo’s friendship, they’d probably say “they’re best friends. Sometimes Cartman’s an ass but when is he not.” Because, as of right now, Cartman and Butters are in a pretty good place. BUT that’s only if you ignore all the trauma from the early seasons.

As of right now, there are two steps that they need to take in their relationship, which both boils down to “Cartman needs to keep getting better so that Butters can learn to trust him”.

The first step is that Cartman needs to stop throwing Butters under the bus during their schemes. This, to me, is the most important part right now.

That’s also why earlier I mentioned how curious I am for their next “get rich quick” scheme given how “Tegrity Farms” turned out, with Cartman making Butters the scapegoat at first but then blackmailing Kyle into helping to use him instead. It does give the hope that Cartman may start using a third person in most schemes.

But then again it is Cartman we’re talking about. Plus, the show isn’t always consistent with its characters. So we’ll just have to wait and see.

The second step is just Cartman continuing to be nice to Butters like he’s been since S17. That’s where the “Butters being afraid of physical violence” comes in, and why I want it to continue.

If Cartman keeps going the way he’s currently going, I hope we’ll get to see Butters slowly learning to drop his guard around Cartman, because Cartman would have deserved it for putting actual effort into this friendship and proving himself to not have any desires to hit Butters at every turn like he used to.

Then, once those two steps are done, it would be time for them to unravel all the trauma from the past seasons and work through this. It’s at this point that they would hit a wall and need to talk things out in order to keep their friendship growing.

Obviously this would never happen because this is SP, I know. But if this was a show that focused on character development, this is how I could see it work.

There is, however, one last issue with this. That issue is Cartman’s desire to change.

I mentioned earlier when talking about the Covid specials how the only thing that was true about Cartman was his love for his family. And that brought me to learn one thing about Cartman : he is capable of love.

Cartman can love someone, he can bring himself to care about someone else other than himself, or at least to a certain degree. Like some have pointed out before, Cartman could have easily destroyed the time machine or time-traveled to kill Kenny or something. But instead, he let his obsessive hatred for Kyle consume him. He didn’t just do it to save his family, he was also being selfish.

But this aside, we do see Cartman capable of being nice to one person specifically, while remaining a manipulative asshole to everyone else. Now the question is, can he do the same for a platonic relationship ? After all, Yentl was his wife. Butters is only a friend, obsession or not.

Don’t get me wrong, Cartman did become nicer to Butters as the show went on. Hell, comparing obsessions and love interests, I tend to say that Cartman with Heidi = Cartman with Kyle and Cartman with Yentl = Cartman with Butters.

What I mean is Heidi and Kyle are people Cartman is incredibly manipulative towards and tried/tries to change for the worst, while Yentl and Butters are cases in which Cartman is the one changing for them.

But still, as much as Cartman might care for Butters and want to be a good friend to him, how much is Cartman capable of caring for Butters ? And as a result, how much is he willing to change ? That’s the main issue here.

Cartman can’t change unless he wants to. You can’t help someone if they don’t want to be helped. Cartman is a narcissist/sociopath. He’s capable of affection, empathy and even love, but to a limited degree.

And because of that, when it comes to his friendship with Butters, while he has shown huge progress as the show went on, there’s no telling how much this progress can continue before hitting a limit. And there’s no telling how much this limit will prevent their relationship from being healthy.

Ultimately, I don’t think their relationship could ever be 100% healthy. Cartman is a huge control freak and I don’t think he’s that capable of change.

That being said, Cartman and Butters could become equals, or at least as close to equals as Cartman is capable of.

As of right now, the closest people to be equals to Cartman are Kenny and Wendy, mostly due to them not being afraid of him. Wendy especially knows how to avoid being manipulated by Cartman and I do think the two could become equals if Cartman had any sort of respect for her (which he doesn’t).

As for Kenny, it’s a mix between not being afraid and Cartman himself having some form of respect for Kenny, and I think that’s what gives me hope that Cartman and Butters’ relationship could be better.

Cartman grew to respect (to an extent) and care for Butters. So if Butters were to grow out of his fear of Cartman’s actions, while Cartman keeps being a softie to him, they could have a better relationship.

Although, such a relationship still wouldn’t be 100% healthy, especially if you imagine them growing up to become con men or CEOs together.

But the main difference would be that, while Cartman could still screw up Butters, Butters could also screw up Cartman and get away with it without Cartman trying to get revenge, and as such without Butters having the fear of said revenge.

It would be far from perfect, nor would it be completely healthy. But given their personalities, this is the best they could have. It might also make their relationship have a more casual feeling to it while still having genuine care for each other. But in any case, I think this is a relationship they would both be content with.

Before finishing with the “other ships opinions”, here’s a few other things I wanted to talk about but didn’t know where to put, in no particular order :

- Despite Cartman being closer to Butters, he seems to still consider Kenny his best friend. Regarding this, I don’t think Cartman has fully realized just how close he and Butters became.

For example, take the scene from “You’re not Yelping” when he gives Butters free food. I feel like, had anybody pointed out to him that he just gave free food to Butters, Cartman would’ve gone “Hey you’re right ! Butters you asshole come back here you owe me money !”

Looking at their recent interactions, it does seem like most of what Cartman does for Butters is “subconscious”, in the sense that he knows that he’s being nice to Butters but probably doesn’t realize just how much he’s doing for that kid, especially compared to literally anybody else.

- When it comes to Cartters, I don’t think it’s enough for Cartman to be nicer towards Butters. Butters also needs to become worse, embrace the darker “fucked up and corrupted con artist” side of him.

I honestly don’t believe in Cartman redeeming himself and becoming a better person overall. But since he is capable of love, I do think that their relationship could work if Butters was on the “unredeemable” side as well. Their relationship wouldn’t be 100% healthy and would have a few hiccups, but it’d work for them. Kind of in a “they deserve each other” sort of way I guess ?

That’s actually something I really like about Cartters : In order to ship it, you need to acknowledge how much of an asshole Butters actually is.

- Cartman’s friendship with Butters is like a double-edged sword to him and I find that very funny. Episodes like “The Magic Bush” or “Tegrity Farms” portray that very well.

On one hand, Cartman now has an incredibly loyal and trustworthy ally. But on the other hand, Butters isn’t taking any of his shit anymore, so Cartman better act like an actual friend if he doesn’t want to lose him.

On that note, that’s also why I really like how much nicer Cartman has been since S17. It’s obvious that he realized how Butters’ growth changed their dynamic, and he’s willing to play nice instead of taking their friendship for granted. And looking at episodes such as “Let Them Eat Goo”, it seems that this dynamic is actually bringing them closer, which is pretty sweet.

- Now that I think about it, this post barely had any mention of the romantic and sexual jokes between them, which are honestly pretty numerous and present across the entire show. But that’s because I’m more focused on their characters and possible chemistry, especially how they evolved and how they could evolve in the future.

While the jokes definitely influenced/shaped my perception of this duo and can absolutely be used as a reason to ship it, what I’m ultimately looking for in a “shipping mindset” are the genuine moments and interactions.

- Speaking of “romantic jokes” tho, I’m still not over the fact that, in the Vaccination Special, Cartman makes a drawing of the “Qties” group in front of the school + the adults that joined. And in that drawing, you can’t recognize any of the kids aside from two :

Scott Malkinson, mostly recognizable due to him being in the center with a jacket and what seems to be his tongue being visible, since the drawing has characters with their mouths open and said mouths are colored in, unlike said tongue.

Butters, seen by his short blonde and kinda-spiky hair + the fact that he’s holding a flag like he did during the fight earlier, showing that Cartman was paying attention to what Butters was doing, either during the fight or while watching the news, since he drew some of the adults accurately which shows he watched the news.

But yeah, it just kills me that Cartman fucking took the time to draw Butters accurately while not giving a single shit about the rest of the Qties. For example, Clyde and Red were part of the group. Good luck seeing them on the board.

- At some point, thinking about the two got me thinking about Scott Malkinson, who some call “the new Butters”. Mostly, it got me thinking about the possibility of Cartman using him for schemes and eventually getting attached to him. But I doubt this would ever happen.

This also led me to realize that, while people call Scott “the new Butters”, there are actually three main differences between them :

1. Scott is morally good. Butters is morally ambiguous.

2. Scott already knows how to talk back to bullies, it’s just that nobody cares. Butters on the other hand had to learn to stand up for himself, which apparently left a much higher impact on the other boys (just look at their reaction in “Going Native”).

3. Scott is very visibly lonely, as we especially see in “Basic Cable”. When he’s alone, he seems to suffer from it. Butters on the other hand never seemed lonely like that. Even in early seasons, when nobody liked him, whenever he was alone he could be seen playing with costumes or drawing or being on his computer etc. While I’m in no way doubting that Butters was lonely back then (and might still be), he was capable of hiding it.

And regarding their relationships with Cartman and why I don’t think Cartman would ever care about Scott : The main reason is that Cartman isn’t obsessed with Scott. Like I said earlier, he doesn’t go out of his way to bully him like he used to do with Butters.

Then you also have the fact that Scott agrees to help Cartman because he’s the most terrified of Cartman + he’s so lonely that he’ll accept any form of acknowledgment. Butters on the other hand is in the schemes because he enjoys it.

You could also say that, with Cartman being paranoid, he only wants one confidant. But then again I don’t know shit about paranoia and couldn’t find something on the internet so take this idea with a grain of salt.

Oh yeah, and also I like comparing the two with Cartman in “Board Girls”, with the scene where they complain to Mackey and the scene in front of the assembly.

In both scenes, Butters speaks unprompted while Scott waits to be asked to talk. On top of that, when Butters interrupts the first time, Cartman just gets mildly annoyed. But when Scott answers Mackey’s question, Cartman gets angry and yells.

As for the scene with the assembly, seeing Butters speak and Cartman glare at him, causing Butters to cower and walk back to his spot reminds me of that one Halloween episode with Satan throwing a sweet 16 party (around S9-10). When the boys try to summon Biggie Smalls, Cartman is hesitating and Butters insults him, causing Cartman to glare at him and raise a fist.

Makes me wonder if Cartman not raising his hand in “Board Girl” was due to them being in front of an assembly, due to him knowing Butters would back away from the stare alone, or due to Cartman simply not having any intention to hurt Butters because he grew to care about him. In any case, Butters cowers due to fear and trauma.

One last thing about comparing these kids is that it made me wonder if there’s any chance for Butters and Scott to be friends. And honestly, I don’t think so. While Butters can be very sweet, he’s also a bully, and Scott is a victim of bullying. On top of that, I could definitely see Butters feeling bad for Scott and Cartman dismissing those worries, which with time would cause Butters to stop caring.

So long story short, I think that, as long as Butters is friends with Cartman, he and Scott won’t be able to be close.

- Episode ideas, one that could help their relationship and one that would be very satisfying :

1. Cartman throws Butters under the bus yet again, Butters is mad and doesn’t want to be his friend anymore, Cartman’s like “That’s fine ! I don’t need you anyways”, Cartman realizes that he’s been relying on Butters for so long now that it’s pretty impossible for him to scheme alone, Cartman tries to get other people to help but doesn’t have the same patience he showcases towards Butters so he can’t stand them when they don’t understand stuff or make mistakes (also they’re not as competent as Butters), Cartman eventually begrudgingly apologizes to Butters and promises to stop throwing him under the bus, Cartman actually has to hold this promise for the rest of the show and starts using other people as scapegoats without growing meaningful friendships with any of them.

2. Cartman has a scheme idea and goes to Butters’ house to ask for his help, Butters is grounded and insists that he can’t leave, Cartman finds a way to convince the Stotches to let the kid out, the whole episode would have Stephen calling Cartman to be like “alright it’s been long enough now bring Butters back” but Cartman keeps delaying it until his scheme is complete, oh and Butters is having the time of his life being away from his parents.

Basically, I just want an episode of Cartman playing mind games with the Stotches parents, with Butters getting no bad consequence whatsoever. Because let’s be honest here, both Stotches parents have mental illnesses, which would make them weak in Cartman’s eyes and incredibly easy to dominate. And while physical violence against horrible people is cathartic, mental games is where the good stuff’s at.

To wrap up, here’s my views on a few other Cartman and Butters ships, for those who are curious :

Cartman

- Stan//man : completely neutral on that one. Don’t particularly like it, don’t particularly dislike it. I tend to find their friendship pretty interesting due to how Cartman doesn’t really have anything against Stan since he isn’t part of any sort of minority (aside from possibly sexuality but it has yet to be canon).

On top of that, Stan doesn’t react in a way that Cartman finds funny. Stan also doesn’t get roped into Cartman’s schemes easily, unless it’s a group effort. So it seems that they could become closer friends. But the issue is Kyle, due to how horrible Cartman is on the poor kid that Stan is incredibly attached to.

So yeah, I’m neutral when it comes to shipping it, meaning I don’t ship it but don’t mind seeing ship art of it. And I do find their friendship interesting in canon, though I don’t think they could grow closer unless Cartman stops being such an asshole towards Kyle, which I doubt will ever happen given the need of a status quo (sort of, the show does have character development).

- Ky//man : possibly my least favorite ship and one that makes me deeply uncomfortable, which probably isn’t helped by the fact that Kyle’s my favorite character and I don’t want to see him suffer like this.

Okay, positive things first, I’ll admit that I do believe that Cartman’s relationship with Kyle is the most interesting Cartman relationship, and the show absolutely wouldn’t be the same without them butting heads all the time.

Another thing I consider more positive : I can’t say I really see much of a possibility for the two of them having a healthy relationship. But tbh, we are talking about fictional characters.

Not every relationship has to be 100% healthy in media. So as long as you’re aware a relationship isn’t perfect and don’t try to romanticize or fetishize the fucked up elements in it (looking at you, proshippers), honestly you’re good to go. If you believe Cartman can be redeemed and Kyle can find it within himself to forgive him, good for you and have fun making your stories !

(Tbh I do believe that one can talk about anything in their story, including fucked up elements. But if you want to write it with a narrator finding it positive, write it from the POV of the perpetrator or a “brainwashed” victim. I do think it’s possible to have a narrator view abuse as “good”, as long as the story is meant to make the reader uncomfortable about it and/or have elements making it very obvious that the narrator has a messed up POV. Oh and obviously please put a disclaimer in the summary or notes to warn about the messed up stuff)

Now, onto the negative (yeah, sorry, this pretty much turned into a rant) : Tbf, when I first heard of the ship, it didn’t surprise me in the slightest because this is like, shipping 101. So when I started re-watching, I was basically “I understand why this exists but it’s not my thing”. And then I reached the episode “Gin//ger Cow”…yeah, let’s just say I went from “not my thing” to “NOPE” very quickly.

So, first things first, my issue with the ship is NOT just the fact that the relationship is inherently toxic with many instances of Cartman being the worst. I mean, I ship Cartters, it’d be hypocritical of me. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

My issue is the fact that, not only had the relationship not gotten better, it got worse. In early seasons, Cartman saw Kyle as a rival to take down, someone he enjoyed for his reactions. But in newer seasons, with episodes like “Gin//ger Cow” and “Human Centi//ipad”, we see that Cartman is fine with Kyle not fighting back as long as it means that Kyle is an object or a trophy that Cartman owns.

That’s my issue with this relationship. It has gotten to a point where it’s just too fucked up for me to enjoy (I mean, I didn’t enjoy it in the first place because enemies to lovers isn’t my thing, but those episodes made my views on this ship worst).

On top of that, you have stuff like Cartman being so much of a stalker that he knows exactly what will make Kyle react in which way, leading to him being able to manipulate Kyle into anything. Like, seriously, look at episodes like “Cr//ack Ba//by Association” or “Tegrity Farms”. If Cartman wants Kyle to do something, he will get Kyle to do that thing, to the point where he even mocks Kyle like in “Le Peti//te Tour//ette” or “Oba//ma Wins”.

Then there’s also the way Cartman swoops in and plays nice with Kyle every single time Stan and Kyle fight, which makes my skin crawl because taking someone when they’re at their most vulnerable and playing nice to gain their trust is incredibly abusive and, as interesting as it is to watch, god does it makes me feel bad for Kyle.

Another thing that doesn’t help is the way Kyle clearly hates Cartman but also sort of needs him due to his desire to be a good person, since Cartman is so obviously the bad guy that it makes Kyle the good guy everytime they fight.

Also Kyle is just so used to the abuse at this point that he kinda normalized it. Which actually makes me think that, if the two were to be separated at some point, Kyle would at first be incredibly happy but then have a phase where he misses Cartman, not only due to the change of status quo that feels weird but also because, without someone who is so obviously the bad guy, it makes it harder to argue with people who actually have a point in their reasoning. Ultimately though, Kyle is much better off with Cartman as far away from him as possible.

All that being said, there is absolutely no denying that Cartman has some sort of unhealthy obsession with Kyle, which has gotten sexual on a few instances. Like said earlier, I don’t consider it love but it’s definitely there. Though, I don’t think Kyle could ever reciprocate, and for his own good, I hope he doesn’t.

Another thing that I’ll agree with is a post I remember reading that had two ideas for how a relationship between them could work. First idea was Kyle being at his most vulnerable and Cartman managing to manipulate him into a relationship, tho obviously it would be toxic. And the second idea is them never seeing each other for years and, once they reunite, Cartman is a better person and Kyle is able to heal and forgive him, which would bring a healthy relationship that works.

Though, about that second idea, looking at “Post Covid/Return of Covid”, I’m not sure how realistic it is. Thing is, like I said earlier, Cartman was only being genuine towards his wife and kids while being an asshole to everyone else. And if he and Kyle were to be in a relationship, I don’t think Kyle would be okay with that. He’ll probably want Cartman to be nice to everyone. Problem is, I don’t think Cartman is actually capable of that. : /

And in general, as much as I love Kyle, I’ll admit I can’t help but think that he’ll be the kind to nitpick or complain about little things a lot, and I doubt Cartman has the patience to deal with someone like that, not helped by the fact that Kyle seems to be pretty fatphobic so he might try to convince Cartman to do something about his diet, enraging the guy.

So yeah, all-in-all, it’s just not my thing.

- Ken//man : neutral-positive on this one. I don’t ship it but I kinda like the idea. Again, I’m a huge “best friends to lovers” person so of course I wouldn’t mind this one.

Besides, it’s interesting how Kenny is one of the kids that are the least afraid of Cartman, possibly due to his immortality. Speaking of which, I’m guessing that Cartman being able to remember Kenny’s death or having some sort of connection to him must be a pretty interesting thing to develop in order to bring them closer for the ship.

Another thing about them that kinda makes me laugh is how one-sided their friendship is, with Cartman clearly considering Kenny his best friend while Kenny doesn’t care about Cartman all that much.

But yeah, in any case, pretty cute friendship with them being close to being equals and you do have the hope of Cartman being nicer towards Kenny as they grow up, since he clearly cares for him. It’s not enough for me to ship it but I definitely like the idea.

- Can//dy : my second favorite Cartman ship. Fun fact, when I first heard of this ship, I had an ironic enjoyment of it because the idea of these two together amused me a lot. Then I read a fic with them being friends + thought about it a bit more and, honestly, I kind of love it. Actually, this is probably one of if not the healthiest relationship Cartman could have, at least when only taking into account the people Cartman knows and had hurt.

I mean, thinking about how people at times compare Kyle and Wendy for being rather similar in their self-rightfulness, I’d honestly go ahead and say that Can//dy is basically Ky//man but better, due to 3 major differences between those two relationships :

1. Cartman doesn’t have an unhealthy obsession towards Wendy the same way he does for Kyle and Butters, which already sets this relationship as healthier than both of them

2. Wendy doesn’t have as much trauma related to Cartman as Kyle and Butters do.

3. Unlike Kyle who’s very gullible and often tries to be the bigger person while fighting Cartman, Wendy doesn’t easily fall for Cartman schemes and doesn’t mind playing dirty. Take the Smurf episode for example. Not only did Wendy not react to Cartman’s taunts for most of the episode, but in the end, she played directly into Cartman’s narrative, getting down his level in order to beat him.

This actually makes their dynamic incredibly interesting and gives their ship tons of potential. Wendy is the one person who not only doesn’t fear Cartman but also knows how to play him.

Then there’s also other things like Wendy in early seasons falling for him that one time, or even episodes like “Pajama Day” with Wendy’s idea being complimented by Cartman for being incredibly manipulative.

Honestly, Can//dy is a girlboss couple with a lot of potential and it’s a shame this ship isn’t that popular, because it’s honestly really good on top of being one of the few Cartman relationships in which Cartman is on almost-equal terms with someone. All Cartman needs is to learn to respect Wendy on a more personal level.

Overall, their relationship has some serious fun and interesting potential.

Butters

- St//utters : neutral-positive. Their friendship in the show is very cute and honestly underrated. Plus, it’s very sweet how protective Stan can be towards Butters at times, like him calling out Cartman in “Grounded Vindaloop”, his anger at the beginning of “Butterballs” (making it seems like he’s the one who wrote the anonymous letter) or him using Butters’ distress in the Pandemic Special, which in a way could be seen as him caring for the kid.

As for Butters, you have him hyping Stan up throughout the entirety of “A Scause for Applause” or him comforting Stan at the end of “Band in China”.

Though, at the same time, it seems that they’re not that close and are willing to bicker for the people they care more about.

For example, Butters being nice to Stan for most of “The Cissy” but then bullying him when Cartman asks him for support. Then there’s also SOT, in that one scene with all the kids arguing at the beginning of the third day (when you’re tasked with recruiting the girls), with Stan speaking up to defend Kyle and Butters speaking up to defend Cartman. You also have Stan telling Butters to shut it in “The Big Fix”.

So yeah, like for Cartman and Kenny, I don’t ship it but don’t mind the idea and can find fanart of it cute.

- Kyu//tters (apparently that’s the name) : neutral. I was gonna say neutral-negative due to their canon interactions but I actually don’t mind the ship in the slightest, even with their canon relationship.

Because yeah, the thing between these two is that they don’t like each other, and by that I mean Butters has continuously been a huge asshole to Kyle and had been shown to bully him on his own on the regular.

Tbh, as much as I love Kyle, I actually find this hilarious. There’s just something about seeing Butters clearly considering everyone to be an asshole but still acting nice with literally everyone else but Kyle. Like Butters really went “fuck this one guy in particular !” and I love it.

Though, I do think that the reason why Butters acts like that is due to his friendship with Cartman. Since Cartman is always the worse with Kyle, it probably made Butters believe that Kyle is an acceptable target.

But this aside, I actually wish we could have more interactions between these two.

Thing is, they’re the two people Cartman is obsessed with. As a result, they’re also the two people who know Cartman the most, or at least they think so.

Gotta be honest, I’d love to see a situation of Kyle talking about how to take down Cartman because he knows everything about him, mentioning a preference Cartman has, only for Butters to be like “actually, Cartman likes X more”. Cue a talk revealing that Butters knows Cartman on a much more personal level due to him being Cartman’s confidant. Also, this could probably lead to Kyle having yet another existential crisis.

Another thought about them and Cartman that could be interesting would be them talking about what they think about the guy.

An idea that came to mind was Cartman ending in juvie/prison and, after a few weeks of happiness, Kyle realizes that he sort of misses Cartman due to how used he is to have him around to oppose. And I feel like, in such a situation, Butters would be the best person Kyle could talk to, because Butters would also feel strange about Cartman not being there. Also, Butters would probably go apeshit on the regular out of boredom because of course he would, I mean c’mon !

So yeah, I don’t really ship it or even see their canon relationship as a friendship, but despite that I don’t mind the ship and can find fanart of it being cute.

That being said, if I had to make a fic with this ship, it would absolutely be the two of them pretending to be in love in order to drive Cartman crazy. I mean, these two are his worst enemy and his closest confidant, both being kids Cartman’s obsessed with. He would not be okay with it and it could be hilarious.

- Bun//ny : neutral-negative, though neutral-positive if it’s Bunn//yman. I don’t ship it, don’t mind it for the most part but is a bit annoyed from how popular it is, especially since this fandom is really into monoshipping (each character has one popular ship that +70% of the fandom sticks to, leading to other ships having little content).

Simply put, my issue with this ship is that I just don’t see any chemistry between them. The only things they have in common is being Cartman’s closest friends and being huge pervs towards women, which isn’t the best approach for a gay ship, even if the characters are bi/pan.

Like some people have said it before, Kenny and Butters are the type of guys who only hang out because they’re both invited by Cartman. And when Cartman leaves the room, they just sit in awkward silence until he comes back.

To explain a bit more my view on them not being compatible, I just feel like Butters is too extreme for Kenny. While Kenny can be a little shit at times, he’s still one of the best people in South Park and has sacrificed himself on several occasions. So I feel like Kenny wouldn’t be okay with someone like Butters, who takes things up to eleven so easily.

Tbh, I’m still surprised that Kenny in Post-Covid agreed to get money through Butters selling NFTs that ruined hundreds if not thousands of lives, especially since Kenny was working for the better of humanity. Also, I’m surprised no-one ever brings up the fact that Kenny was okay with NFTs, unless Butters/Vic never told him.

So yeah, their personalities just feel too different on that front. That’s also why I think they both work better with Cartman, including as a trio, since Cartman can be more or less extreme depending on the situation, making him a good fit for both.

As for their friendship in the show, they’re honestly not that close, and it’s pretty surprising that what seems to be the official SP wiki singles out Butters’ friendship with Kenny (along with Cartman’s) instead of Stan’s, whom Butters acts closer to.

On a shipping POV though, it is pretty funny to see this page call Kenny’s views on Butters “big-bro instinct” in a sense, even comparing how Kenny acts towards Butters to how he is with his little sister. But this aside, they just barely interact in the show unless Cartman is involved.

One last thing about them, though it’s a headcanon, is the idea that Kenny feels some resentment against Butters.

Basically, it’s due to the fact that, in early seasons, it was always the main 4 together. And with Stan and Kyle being closer friends, Cartman and Kenny kind of latched onto each other as best friends.

Then Kenny died and Cartman tried to replace him. And even after Kenny came back, while Tweek went back to being a minor character, Butters stayed in the front line, mostly because Cartman wanted him to. Which even led to episodes in which Kenny isn’t with the group at all but Butters is, like “Canada On Strike”.

So basically, there’s this headcanon that, for a long time, Kenny resented Butters for taking his place not only in the group (sorta) but also as Cartman’s best friend. Though I like to imagine that, after “Going Native”, Kenny grew to accept Butters and that’s when he started having that “brotherly protectiveness” towards him.

If you’re still here, thanks for reading such a long-ass thing ! 😅

#South Park #SP #Eric Cartman #Butters Stotch #Cartters #SP Buttman #hey look I'm finally posting again !#just took me like three months AFTER announcing I would post another two months since the last post #actually it was four months because of course it was #fun fact actually : I already moved on to another fandom #THAT'S how long this thing's been sitting in my computer !#anyways #I REALLY hope it's not too hard to read #I really went full essay mode with this one #meaning many MANY words are repeated 😓#Flor talks #long post #REALLY long post #(probably my longest to date outside of fics)

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